Astro Foorumi

Astro special => Sideerinen astrologia => Aiheen aloitti: sideman - 01.03.2013 11:25:15



Otsikko: Tulkitkaamme Diirghatamasta!
Kirjoitti: sideman - 01.03.2013 11:25:15
Rgvedan [~ rigveedan] ekan maNDalan 164. hymni (suukta) lienee yksi filosofisimmista ja arvoituksellisimmista hindujen "vanhan testamentin" pläjäyksistä. Sen näkijä (RSi) on nimeltään Diirghatamas (diirgha-tamas: pitkä pimeys[?], koska hän oli
hänelle äitinsä kohdussa langetetun kirouksen takia syntymäsokea).

Tuota suuktaa kutsutaan tuttavallisesti nimellä 'asyavaamasya' [asjavaamasja], koska sen kaksi eka sanaa ova 'asya' ja 'vaamasya'.

Hymnin sanotaan sisältävän rutkasti astronoomista symboliikkaa. Olisi kiintoisaa tietää, millaisia mielikuvia allaoleva
Ralph T. H. Griffith'in käännös (1896) herättää...

HYMN CLXIV. Viśvedevas.

1. OF this benignant Priest, with eld grey-coloured, the brother midmost of the three is lightning.
The third is he whose back with oil is sprinkled. Here I behold the Chief with seven male children.

asya vAmasya palitasya hotustasya bhrAtA madhyamo astyashnaH |
tRtIyo bhrAtA ghRtapRShTho asyAtrApashyaM vishpatiM saptaputram || 1.164.01

asya vaamasya palitasya hotuH; tasya bhraataa madhyamaH; asti; ashnaH |
tRtiiyaH; bhraataa ghRta-pRShThaH; asya atra apashyam; vishpatim sapta-putram || 1.
164.01

Summittainen ääntämisohje:

asja vaamasja palitasja hootus tasja bhraataa madhjamoo astjashnahaa |
tritiijoo bhraataa ghritapriShThoo asjaatraapashjam vishpatim saptaputram || 1.164.01


2 Seven to the one-wheeled chariot yoke the Courser; bearing seven names the single Courser draws it.
Three-naved the wheel is, sound and undecaying, whereon are resting all these worlds of being.
3 The seven who on the seven-wheeled car are mounted have horses, seven in tale, who draw them onward.
Seven Sisters utter songs of praise together, in whom the names of the seven Cows are treasured.
4 Who hath beheld him as he sprang to being, seen how the boneless One supports the bony?
Where is the blood of earth, the life, the spirit? Who may approach the man who knows, to ask it?
5 Unripe in mind, in spirit undiscerning, I ask of these the Gods’ established places;
For up above the yearling Calf the sages, to form a web, their own seven threads have woven.
6 I ask, unknowing, those who know, the sages, as one all ignorant for sake of knowledge,
What was that ONE who in the Unborn's image hath stablished and fixed firm these worlds' six regions.
7 Let him who knoweth presently declare it, this lovely Bird's securely founded station.
Forth from his head the Cows draw milk, and, wearing his vesture, with their foot have drunk the water.
8 The Mother gave the Sire his share of Order: with thought, at first, she wedded him in spirit.
She, the coy Dame, was filled with dew prolific: with adoration men approached to praise her.
9 Yoked was the Mother to the boon Cow's car-pole: in the dank rows of cloud the Infant rested.
Then the Calf lowed, and looked upon the Mother, the Cow who wears all shapes in three directions.
10 Bearing three Mothers and three Fathers, single he stood erect: they never make him weary.
There on the pitch of heaven they speak together in speech all-knowing but not all-impelling.
11 Formed with twelve spokes, by length of time, unweakened, rolls round the heaven this wheel of during Order.
Herein established, joined in pairs together, seven hundred Sons and twenty stand, O Agni.
12 They call him in the farther half of heaven the Sire five-footed, of twelve forms, wealthy in watery store.
These others say that he, God with far-seeing eyes, is mounted on the lower seven-wheeled, six-spoked car.
13 Upon this five-spoked wheel revolving ever all living creatures rest and are dependent.
Its axle, heavy-laden, is not heated: the nave from ancient time remains unbroken.
14 The wheel revolves, unwasting, with its felly: ten draw it, yoked to the far-stretching car-pole.
The Sun's eye moves encompassed by the region: on him dependent rest all living creatures.
15 Of the co-born they call the seventh single-born; the six twin pairs are called Ṛṣis, Children of Gods.
Their good gifts sought of men are ranged in order due, and various in their form move for the Lord who guides.
16 They told me these were males, though truly females: he who hath eyes sees this, the blind discerns not.
The son who is a sage hath comprehended: who knows this rightly is his father's father.
17 Beneath the upper realm, above this lower, bearing her calf at foot the Cow hath risen.
Witherward, to what place hath she departed? Where calves she? Not amid this herd of cattle.
18 Who, that the father of this Calf discerneth beneath the upper realm, above the lower,
Showing himself a sage, may here declare it? Whence hath the Godlike spirit had its rising?
19 Those that come hitherward they call departing, those that depart they call directed hither.
And what so ye have made, Indra and Soma, steeds bear as ’twere yoked to the region's car-pole.
20 Two Birds with fair wings, knit with bonds of friendship, in the same sheltering tree have found a refuge.
One of the twain eats the sweet Fig-tree's fruitage; the other eating not regardeth only.
21 Where those fine Birds hymn ceaselessly their portion of life eternal, and the sacred synods,
There is the Universe's mighty Keeper, who, wise, hath entered into me the simple.
22 The, tree whereon the fine Birds eat the sweetness, where they all rest and procreate their offspring,—
Upon its top they say the fig is luscious: none gaineth it who knoweth not the Father.
23 How on the Gāyatrī the Gāyatrī was based, how from the Triṣṭup they fashioned the Triṣṭup forth,
How on the Jagatī was based the Jagatī,—they who know this have won themselves immortal life.
24 With Gāyatrī he measures out the praise-song, Sāma with praise-song, triplet with the Triṣṭup.
The triplet with the two or four-foot measure, and with the syllable they form seven metres.
25 With Jagatī the flood in heaven he stablished, and saw the Sun in the Rathantara Sāman.
Gāyatrī hath, they say, three brands for kindling: hence it excels in majesty and vigour.
26 I invocate the milch-cow good for milking so that the milker, deft of hand, may drain her.
May Savitar give goodliest stimulation. The caldron is made hot; I will proclaim it.
27 She, lady of all treasure, is come hither yearning in spirit for her calf and lowing.
May this cow yield her milk for both the Aśvins, and may she prosper to our high advantage.
28 The cow hath lowed after her blinking youngling; she licks his forehead, as she lows, to form it.
His mouth she fondly calls to her warm udder, and suckles him with milk while gently lowing.
29 He also snorts, by whom encompassed round the Cow laws as she clings unto the shedder of the rain.
She with her shrilling cries hath humbled mortal man, and, turned to lightning, hath stripped off her covering robe.
30 That which hath breath and speed and life and motion lies firmly stablished in the midst of houses.
Living, by offerings to the Dead he moveth Immortal One, the brother of the mortal.
31 I saw the Herdsman, him who never stumbles, approaching by his pathways and departing.
He, clothed with gathered and diffusive splendour, within the worlds continually travels.
32 He who hath made him cloth not comprehend him: from him who saw him surely is he hidden.
He, yet enveloped in his Mother's bosom, source of much life, hath sunk into destruction.
33 Dyaus is my Father, my begetter: kinship is here. This great earth is my kin and Mother.
Between the wide-spread world-halves is the birth-place: the Father laid the Daughter's germ within it.
34 I ask thee of the earth's extremest limit, where is the centre of the world, I ask thee.
I ask thee of the Stallion's seed prolific, I ask of highest heaven where Speech abideth.
35 This altar is the earth's extremest limit; this sacrifice of ours is the world's centre.
The Stallion's seed prolific is the Soma; this Brahman highest heaven where Speech abideth.
36 Seven germs unripened yet are heaven's prolific seed: their functions they maintain by Viṣṇu's ordinance.
Endued with wisdom through intelligence and thought, they compass us about present on every side.
37 What thing I truly am I know not clearly: mysterious, fettered in my mind I wander.
When the first-born of holy Law approached me, then of this speech I first obtain a portion.
38 Back, forward goes he, grasped by strength inherent, the Immortal born the brother of the mortal
Ceaseless they move in opposite directions: men mark the one, and fail to mark the other.
39 Upon what syllable of holy praise-song, as twere their highest heaven, the Gods repose them,—
Who knows not this, what will he do with praise-song? But they who know it well sit here assembled.
40 Fortunate mayst thou be with goodly pasture, and may we also be exceeding wealthy.
Feed on the grass, O Cow, at every season, and coming hitherward drink limpid water.
41 Forming the water-floods, the buffalo hath lowed, one-footed or two-footed or four-footed, she,
Who hath become eight-footed or hath got nine feet, the thousand-syllabled in the sublimest heaven.
42 From her descend in streams the seas of water; thereby the world's four regions have their being,
Thence flows the imperishable flood and thence the universe hath life.
43 I saw from far away the smoke of fuel with spires that rose on high o’er that beneath it.
The Mighty Men have dressed the spotted bullock. These were the customs in the days aforetime,
44 Three with long tresses show in ordered season. One of them sheareth when the year is ended.
One with his powers the universe regardeth: Of one, the sweep is seen, but his figure.
45 Speech hath been measured out in four divisions, the Brahmans who have understanding know them.
Three kept in close concealment cause no motion; of speech, men speak only the fourth division.
46 They call him Indra, Mitra, Varuṇa, Agni, and he is heavenly nobly-winged Garutmān.
To what is One, sages give many a title they call it Agni, Yama, Mātariśvan.
47 Dark the descent: the birds are golden-coloured; up to the heaven they fly robed in the waters.
Again descend they from the seat of Order, and all the earth is moistened with their fatness.
48 Twelve are the fellies, and the wheel is single; three are the naves. What man hath understood it?
Therein are set together spokes three hundred and sixty, which in nowise can be loosened.
49 That breast of thine exhaustless, spring of pleasure, wherewith thou feedest all things that are choicest,
Wealth-giver, treasure. finder, free bestower,—bring that, Sarasvatī, that we may drain it.
50 By means of sacrifice the Gods accomplished their sacrifice: these were the earliest ordinances.
These Mighty Ones attained the height of heaven, there where the Sādhyas, Gods of old, are dwelling.
51 Uniform, with the passing days, this water mounts and fails again.
The tempest-clouds give life to earth, and fires re-animate the heaven.
52 The Bird Celestial, vast with noble pinion, the lovely germ of plants, the germ of waters,
Him who delighteth us with rain in season, Sarasvān I invoke that he may help us.

Next: HYMN CLXV. Indra. Maruts.


Otsikko: Vs: Tulkitkaamme Diirghatamasta!
Kirjoitti: spin - 11.03.2013 21:52:37
Burana caps.....


Otsikko: Vs: Tulkitkaamme Diirghatamasta!
Kirjoitti: sideman - 12.03.2013 21:04:42
Burana caps.....

ROFLOL!     ;D   :2funny:

havel havelim omar kohelet, havel havelim! hakol havel!    ???


Otsikko: Vs: Tulkitkaamme Diirghatamasta!
Kirjoitti: t.touhula - 18.03.2013 11:44:27
Hymnin sanotaan sisältävän rutkasti astronoomista symboliikkaa. Olisi kiintoisaa tietää, millaisia mielikuvia allaoleva
Ralph T. H. Griffith'in käännös (1896) herättää...

Eipä riitä aika juurikaan tuollaista alkaa kääntää. Kuitenkin lukemani herätti ajatuksen, kuinka saamme olla britteille kiitollisia tällaisten viisauksien saamisesta myös länsimaalaisten omiin maihin ja omille kielille, vaikka heidän hallinta-aikansa nykyisten Intian ja Pakistanin alueella ei varmaankaan ole ollut helppoa paikallisille kestää -kuten ei minkään kulttuurin hajottaminen tai muuntaminen alueen alkuperäisasukkaille. Kuitenkaan ilman muutoksia ei maailma kehity, eikä ihminen siinä mukana.

Pitänee ajatuksella tekstiä läpikäydä. Viitteitä, kuten Bhagavadghita'stakin, löytyy samaperäiseen tekstiin kuin Raamatussa ja niin monenmonessa vanhoissa uskonnoista ja eri kulttuureista kertovissa kirjoissa.

Kiitos kun olet nähnyt vaivaa tämän tiedon levittämisestä.


Otsikko: Vs: Tulkitkaamme Diirghatamasta!
Kirjoitti: sideman - 22.04.2013 14:09:56
Hymnin sanotaan sisältävän rutkasti astronoomista symboliikkaa. Olisi kiintoisaa tietää, millaisia mielikuvia allaoleva
Ralph T. H. Griffith'in käännös (1896) herättää...

Eipä riitä aika juurikaan tuollaista alkaa kääntää. Kuitenkin lukemani herätti ajatuksen, kuinka saamme olla britteille kiitollisia tällaisten viisauksien saamisesta myös länsimaalaisten omiin maihin ja omille kielille, vaikka heidän hallinta-aikansa nykyisten Intian ja Pakistanin alueella ei varmaankaan ole ollut helppoa paikallisille kestää -kuten ei minkään kulttuurin hajottaminen tai muuntaminen alueen alkuperäisasukkaille. Kuitenkaan ilman muutoksia ei maailma kehity, eikä ihminen siinä mukana.

Pitänee ajtuksella tekstiä läpikäydä. Viitteitä, kuten Bhagavadghita'stakin, löytyy samaperäiseen tekstiin kuin Raamatussa ja niin monenmonessa vanhoissa uskonnoista ja eri kulttuureista kertovissa kirjoissa.

Kiitos kun olet nähnyt vaivaa tämän tiedon levittämisestä.

Eipä kestä! Olisi varmaankin korkea aika opetella kirjoittamaan vähän asiallisemmalla
tyylillä, mutta kun taidan olla perusluonteeltani sellainen, että en kykene oikein
mitään ns. älyllisyyteen liittyvää ottamaan kovin vakavasti, vaikka siitä diggaisinkin
kuin hullu puurosta!